Green Mtn
location: Observing the Progressive madness with considerably less amusement.
listening to: Grandchildren, the best reason for saving the future.
registered: 2004.04.03
posts: 2617
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Another of Rockwell's Top 10 of 2007. I saw this guy on 60 Minutes recently. No wonder so many folks are afraid of Evangelicals. But I
gotta tellya, all Christians are not like this fella or his followers. The first tell(ing sign/you'll know
them by their fruit) should be the political birds that flock with him. Or as I view this matter, make
use of him/he's sold out to. Call me judgmental, but I question this fella's validity, in terms of the
faith. At the very least he's sold out, but more likely, as the scripture describes it:
2Co 11:14,15* And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it
is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end
shall be according to their works. http://www.lewrockwell.com/barnwell/barnwell73.htmlTV Evangelist John Hagee Wants War With Iran, and He Wants It Now!by Bill BarnwellIf anyone still thinks that the radical end-times "prophecy" movement is not a threat to peace and
stability, think again. At the popular level, in terms of the TV preachers and the hot-selling
prophecy books, the dispensational pre-trib stuff still reigns supreme. Most conservative-leaning
Evangelical churches in America today are heavily influenced by popular dispensational theology to
some extent. Even churches and pastors that don’t teach pretribulationalism still are influenced by
dispensationalism to varying degrees.The most dangerous element of this prophetic paradigm, however, is its doom-and-gloom view of
the world. And in most cases, those who have a fascination with the end of the world have a
particular fascination with war and militarism as well. More problematic, it assumes that their wars
of choice are not just their own foreign policy preferences or personal opinions. Rather they are
ordained by God. In 2003, more than a few pastors and influential Christian figures basically said
that opposing the Iraq war was opposing God’s end-time plan. According to Evangelical end-times
enthusiasts, if you opposed the Iraq war, you didn’t just hate your country and the troops, now you
were opposing God and the Bible as well.An even bigger obsession for dispensationalists has always been Israel. For the average
dispensationalist, modern-day secular Israel is going to be the focal point in the end-times.
Therefore, if the Bible really does teach in Daniel 9:27 that the Al-Aqsa Mosque is going to be torn
down for a rebuilt Jewish Temple, why should any of us seek to prevent it? Sure, it very well might
ignite a regional war and even ignite tensions around the world, but it's all part of God’s prophetic
plan. Not to worry though, things might not get really ugly until after the "rapture," so the
Christians today who are cheering for events that would bring about World War III won’t have to
worry about it anyway. Unless of course, they are wrong about the whole thing.Enter the Rev. John Hagee. Hagee is the pastor of Cornerstone Church in San Antonio Texas, where
he has 18,000 followers right in his own congregation. He also has a global television ministry and
has sold scores of prophecy books over the years. John Hagee is perhaps the most powerful and
influential Christian Zionist figure in America. Hagee has a long history making strange predictions
about world events that are almost always wrong. His books in the late 90’s trumped up Y2K
hysteria to ridiculous levels. He inaccurately predicted that the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin was
the "Beginning of the End" in the book of the same name. In every book he writes, he is constantly
warning of catastrophe in various forms right around the corner. According to one of his fans, he
supposedly just preached a sermon predicting that 2007 would be a "significant" year in Bible
prophecy and that his prophecy claims can be "mathematically" backed up by the Biblical text.Given Hagee’s prior success rate in making predictions, don’t be shocked if 2007 doesn’t shape up
to be all that "significant" after all. As with all popular prophecy teachers, they are immune from
making inaccurate predictions and false prophecies. Their followers simply forget or forgive them.
Maybe they’ll even claim that God changed His mind. Most don’t even pay attention though and
don’t even realize their superstars are constantly revising their predictions and end-times charts.However, Hagee is not just another goofy eccentric on TBN. He has political clout and regularly
meets with influential national politicians. If you’ve ever watched him on TV, he clearly basks in this
fact and drops little hints about his discussions with people in governmental authority and other
positions of power. For years Hagee has hosted "A Night to Honor" Israel and is founder and
chairman of Christians United for Israel. Their goals span beyond supporting Israel, but also
implementing a one-sided and radical approach to the Arab-Israeli problems in the Middle East.
There is no nuance to their policy prescriptions and ironically (or perhaps not so ironically) the
agenda of Hagee and his group would actually make matters much worse in the Middle East.And he has more than a few fans out there. He has not been afraid to remind his church and
television audience, repeatedly over the years, that there are "millions in America and around the
world watching this program right now." Whatever the number really is, what is clear is that Hagee
is reaching many people and has a networking system that spans into the rich and powerful, some
of whom are making national foreign policy decisions.If left up to Hagee, there would be a military strike against Iran today. Since last summer, Hagee
has been practically foaming at the mouth for a new war with Iran. Why? Because he thinks it is the
rest of the world’s job to fight Israel’s wars and because he thinks such a showdown is a piece of
the puzzle in regards to Bible prophecy. To Hagee, there is no middle ground on this issue. God told
Abraham he would "bless those who bless you and curse those who curse you" (Gen. 12:3). That
means if YOU aren’t on board with wars that might be in Israel’s interest, but not in the United
States’, then YOU will be cursed by God. At least according to Hagee.To see just how bellicose, belligerent, and militaristic Hagee has come, just watch his speech at the
AIPAC Washington conference. Behind his thundering prose and love for the Jewish people is a
militaristic and even fanatical mindset that is hoping and praying for the world to fall apart. After
all, Jesus can’t come back unless it does, but all is well since Christians before the "rapture" will
escape the worst of it.Unfortunately for the Jewish people, they still await another massive holocaust, according to many
dispensationalists. Anyone interested in this subject should read our own Gary North’s column, The
Unannounced Reason Behind American Fundamentalism's Support for the State of Israel. An
excerpt:Nothing can or will be done by Christians to save Israel’s Jews from this disaster, for all of the
Christians will have been removed from this world three and a half years prior to the beginning of
this 42-month period of tribulation. (The total period of seven years is interpreted as the fulfillment
of the seventieth week of Daniel [Dan. 9:27].)In order for most of today’s Christians to escape physical death, two-thirds of the Jews in Israel
must perish, soon. This is the grim prophetic trade-off that fundamentalists rarely discuss publicly,
but which is the central motivation in the movement’s support for Israel. It should be clear why
they believe that Israel must be defended at all costs by the West. If Israel were militarily removed
from history prior to the Rapture, then the strongest case for Christians’ imminent escape from
death would have to be abandoned. This would mean the indefinite delay of the Rapture. The
fundamentalist movement thrives on the doctrine of the imminent Rapture, not the indefinitely
postponed Rapture.Every time you hear the phrase, "Jesus is coming back soon," you should mentally add, "and two-
thirds of the Jews of Israel will be dead in ‘soon plus 84 months.’" Fundamentalists really do believe
that they probably will not die physically, but to secure this faith prophetically, they must defend
the doctrine of an inevitable holocaust.This specific motivation for the support of Israel is never preached from any fundamentalist pulpit.
The faithful hear sermons – many, many sermons – on the pretribulation Rapture. On other
occasions, they hear sermons on the Great Tribulation. But they do not hear the two themes put
together: "We can avoid death, but only because two-thirds of the Jews of Israel will inevitably die
in a future holocaust. America must therefore support the nation of Israel in order to keep the
Israelis alive until after the Rapture." Fundamentalist ministers expect their congregations to put
two and two together on their own. It would be politically incorrect to add up these figures in
public.Again, however, one can’t make too big a fuss about this, since "Bible prophecy" demands this
carnage. It’s "God’s will" for the world to fall apart, for tensions to further inflame between Jews and
Arabs, for the United States to lead the charge in a pre-emptive strike on Iran, to rebuild a third
Jewish Temple after tearing down the Islamic mosque, etc. All you have to do to prove this is cut
passages like Genesis 12, Matthew 24, 2 Thessalonians 2, Ezekiel 36 and 37, and Daniel 9:24–27
out of context (along with the entire book of Revelation), make up some handy-dandy prophecy
charts, and confidently present it to Biblically illiterate Christians who don’t know any better.While there are many doctrinal disputes amongst Christians, there are none that have as much
practical significance as this one. I strongly disagree with those who deny the Trinity, but those
who deny the deity of Christ are not clamoring for war, bombs, and destruction. Likewise,
Christians disagree vehemently over issues like eternal security or the proper mode of baptism, but
thankfully we’ve grown up and stopped killing each other over those issues in the last couple
hundred years.When it comes to questionable or inaccurate beliefs about the end-times, however, they are
shaping many people’s foreign policy and worldviews for the worse. It is causing many to hold
troubling escapist views towards the world. I know this because I am constantly told by other
Christians that "we are not in the business of fixing up the world, we are just in the business of
saving souls until the rapture!" It is in part because of faulty eschatology that Evangelical Christians,
more than any other demographic group in America, supported the ill-advised invasion of Iraq in
2003. And it is faulty eschatology that is causing this same group of people to believe the
militaristic agenda behind Rev. Hagee’s bombastic oratory. After all, it’s all been ordained, so how
can we oppose it?But maybe, just maybe, their preciously held beliefs about future prophecy are way off. Maybe they
are dead wrong in their views and maybe all the wars, destruction and carnage they think are
inevitable aren’t necessarily mandated by God. Maybe the Bible is teaching exactly the opposite
regarding these matters than what they teach.Alas, no matter how many false predictions these guys make, or how many damaging theological
and political beliefs they espouse, people continue to follow their dangerous teachings. It’s time for
both Christian and non-Christian alike to call this crowd out on their bad theology, false
prophecies, and deadly worldview.Hopefully Hagee is right that 2007 is going to be a significant year in Bible prophecy. It would be
significant indeed if Biblical scholars, pastors and laymen finally and at long last rescued the
doctrine of eschatology from the doom and destruction crowd of militaristic pretribulationists.
Here’s hoping that with each passing year the theology of Hagee and his ilk is exposed for how
Biblically inaccurate and destructive it really is.March 22, 2007
–--
“Restriction of free thought and free speech is the most dangerous of all subversions.” Wm O. Douglas
“Restriction of free thought and free speech is the most dangerous of all subversions.” Wm O. Douglas
G
Green Mtn
(view)
Another of Rockwell's Top 10 of 2007. I saw this guy on 60 Minutes recently. No wonder so many folks are afraid of Evangelicals. But I
gotta tellya, all Christians are not like this fella or his followers. The first tell(ing sign/you'll know
them by their fruit) should be the political birds that flock with him. Or as I view this matter, make
use of him/he's sold out to. Call me judgmental, but I question this fella's validity, in terms of the
faith. At the very least he's sold out, but more likely, as the scripture describes it:
2Co 11:14,15* And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it
is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end
shall be according to their works. http://www.lewrockwell.com/barnwell/barnwell73.htmlTV Evangelist John Hagee Wants War With Iran, and He Wants It Now!by Bill BarnwellIf anyone still thinks that the radical end-times "prophecy" movement is not a threat to peace and
stability, think again. At the popular level, in terms of the TV preachers and the hot-selling
prophecy books, the dispensational pre-trib stuff still reigns supreme. Most conservative-leaning
Evangelical churches in America today are heavily influenced by popular dispensational theology to
some extent. Even churches and pastors that don’t teach pretribulationalism still are influenced by
dispensationalism to varying degrees.The most dangerous element of this prophetic paradigm, however, is its doom-and-gloom view of
the world. And in most cases, those who have a fascination with the end of the world have a
particular fascination with war and militarism as well. More problematic, it assumes that their wars
of choice are not just their own foreign policy preferences or personal opinions. Rather they are
ordained by God. In 2003, more than a few pastors and influential Christian figures basically said
that opposing the Iraq war was opposing God’s end-time plan. According to Evangelical end-times
enthusiasts, if you opposed the Iraq war, you didn’t just hate your country and the troops, now you
were opposing God and the Bible as well.An even bigger obsession for dispensationalists has always been Israel. For the average
dispensationalist, modern-day secular Israel is going to be the focal point in the end-times.
Therefore, if the Bible really does teach in Daniel 9:27 that the Al-Aqsa Mosque is going to be torn
down for a rebuilt Jewish Temple, why should any of us seek to prevent it? Sure, it very well might
ignite a regional war and even ignite tensions around the world, but it's all part of God’s prophetic
plan. Not to worry though, things might not get really ugly until after the "rapture," so the
Christians today who are cheering for events that would bring about World War III won’t have to
worry about it anyway. Unless of course, they are wrong about the whole thing.Enter the Rev. John Hagee. Hagee is the pastor of Cornerstone Church in San Antonio Texas, where
he has 18,000 followers right in his own congregation. He also has a global television ministry and
has sold scores of prophecy books over the years. John Hagee is perhaps the most powerful and
influential Christian Zionist figure in America. Hagee has a long history making strange predictions
about world events that are almost always wrong. His books in the late 90’s trumped up Y2K
hysteria to ridiculous levels. He inaccurately predicted that the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin was
the "Beginning of the End" in the book of the same name. In every book he writes, he is constantly
warning of catastrophe in various forms right around the corner. According to one of his fans, he
supposedly just preached a sermon predicting that 2007 would be a "significant" year in Bible
prophecy and that his prophecy claims can be "mathematically" backed up by the Biblical text.Given Hagee’s prior success rate in making predictions, don’t be shocked if 2007 doesn’t shape up
to be all that "significant" after all. As with all popular prophecy teachers, they are immune from
making inaccurate predictions and false prophecies. Their followers simply forget or forgive them.
Maybe they’ll even claim that God changed His mind. Most don’t even pay attention though and
don’t even realize their superstars are constantly revising their predictions and end-times charts.However, Hagee is not just another goofy eccentric on TBN. He has political clout and regularly
meets with influential national politicians. If you’ve ever watched him on TV, he clearly basks in this
fact and drops little hints about his discussions with people in governmental authority and other
positions of power. For years Hagee has hosted "A Night to Honor" Israel and is founder and
chairman of Christians United for Israel. Their goals span beyond supporting Israel, but also
implementing a one-sided and radical approach to the Arab-Israeli problems in the Middle East.
There is no nuance to their policy prescriptions and ironically (or perhaps not so ironically) the
agenda of Hagee and his group would actually make matters much worse in the Middle East.And he has more than a few fans out there. He has not been afraid to remind his church and
television audience, repeatedly over the years, that there are "millions in America and around the
world watching this program right now." Whatever the number really is, what is clear is that Hagee
is reaching many people and has a networking system that spans into the rich and powerful, some
of whom are making national foreign policy decisions.If left up to Hagee, there would be a military strike against Iran today. Since last summer, Hagee
has been practically foaming at the mouth for a new war with Iran. Why? Because he thinks it is the
rest of the world’s job to fight Israel’s wars and because he thinks such a showdown is a piece of
the puzzle in regards to Bible prophecy. To Hagee, there is no middle ground on this issue. God told
Abraham he would "bless those who bless you and curse those who curse you" (Gen. 12:3). That
means if YOU aren’t on board with wars that might be in Israel’s interest, but not in the United
States’, then YOU will be cursed by God. At least according to Hagee.To see just how bellicose, belligerent, and militaristic Hagee has come, just watch his speech at the
AIPAC Washington conference. Behind his thundering prose and love for the Jewish people is a
militaristic and even fanatical mindset that is hoping and praying for the world to fall apart. After
all, Jesus can’t come back unless it does, but all is well since Christians before the "rapture" will
escape the worst of it.Unfortunately for the Jewish people, they still await another massive holocaust, according to many
dispensationalists. Anyone interested in this subject should read our own Gary North’s column, The
Unannounced Reason Behind American Fundamentalism's Support for the State of Israel. An
excerpt:Nothing can or will be done by Christians to save Israel’s Jews from this disaster, for all of the
Christians will have been removed from this world three and a half years prior to the beginning of
this 42-month period of tribulation. (The total period of seven years is interpreted as the fulfillment
of the seventieth week of Daniel [Dan. 9:27].)In order for most of today’s Christians to escape physical death, two-thirds of the Jews in Israel
must perish, soon. This is the grim prophetic trade-off that fundamentalists rarely discuss publicly,
but which is the central motivation in the movement’s support for Israel. It should be clear why
they believe that Israel must be defended at all costs by the West. If Israel were militarily removed
from history prior to the Rapture, then the strongest case for Christians’ imminent escape from
death would have to be abandoned. This would mean the indefinite delay of the Rapture. The
fundamentalist movement thrives on the doctrine of the imminent Rapture, not the indefinitely
postponed Rapture.Every time you hear the phrase, "Jesus is coming back soon," you should mentally add, "and two-
thirds of the Jews of Israel will be dead in ‘soon plus 84 months.’" Fundamentalists really do believe
that they probably will not die physically, but to secure this faith prophetically, they must defend
the doctrine of an inevitable holocaust.This specific motivation for the support of Israel is never preached from any fundamentalist pulpit.
The faithful hear sermons – many, many sermons – on the pretribulation Rapture. On other
occasions, they hear sermons on the Great Tribulation. But they do not hear the two themes put
together: "We can avoid death, but only because two-thirds of the Jews of Israel will inevitably die
in a future holocaust. America must therefore support the nation of Israel in order to keep the
Israelis alive until after the Rapture." Fundamentalist ministers expect their congregations to put
two and two together on their own. It would be politically incorrect to add up these figures in
public.Again, however, one can’t make too big a fuss about this, since "Bible prophecy" demands this
carnage. It’s "God’s will" for the world to fall apart, for tensions to further inflame between Jews and
Arabs, for the United States to lead the charge in a pre-emptive strike on Iran, to rebuild a third
Jewish Temple after tearing down the Islamic mosque, etc. All you have to do to prove this is cut
passages like Genesis 12, Matthew 24, 2 Thessalonians 2, Ezekiel 36 and 37, and Daniel 9:24–27
out of context (along with the entire book of Revelation), make up some handy-dandy prophecy
charts, and confidently present it to Biblically illiterate Christians who don’t know any better.While there are many doctrinal disputes amongst Christians, there are none that have as much
practical significance as this one. I strongly disagree with those who deny the Trinity, but those
who deny the deity of Christ are not clamoring for war, bombs, and destruction. Likewise,
Christians disagree vehemently over issues like eternal security or the proper mode of baptism, but
thankfully we’ve grown up and stopped killing each other over those issues in the last couple
hundred years.When it comes to questionable or inaccurate beliefs about the end-times, however, they are
shaping many people’s foreign policy and worldviews for the worse. It is causing many to hold
troubling escapist views towards the world. I know this because I am constantly told by other
Christians that "we are not in the business of fixing up the world, we are just in the business of
saving souls until the rapture!" It is in part because of faulty eschatology that Evangelical Christians,
more than any other demographic group in America, supported the ill-advised invasion of Iraq in
2003. And it is faulty eschatology that is causing this same group of people to believe the
militaristic agenda behind Rev. Hagee’s bombastic oratory. After all, it’s all been ordained, so how
can we oppose it?But maybe, just maybe, their preciously held beliefs about future prophecy are way off. Maybe they
are dead wrong in their views and maybe all the wars, destruction and carnage they think are
inevitable aren’t necessarily mandated by God. Maybe the Bible is teaching exactly the opposite
regarding these matters than what they teach.Alas, no matter how many false predictions these guys make, or how many damaging theological
and political beliefs they espouse, people continue to follow their dangerous teachings. It’s time for
both Christian and non-Christian alike to call this crowd out on their bad theology, false
prophecies, and deadly worldview.Hopefully Hagee is right that 2007 is going to be a significant year in Bible prophecy. It would be
significant indeed if Biblical scholars, pastors and laymen finally and at long last rescued the
doctrine of eschatology from the doom and destruction crowd of militaristic pretribulationists.
Here’s hoping that with each passing year the theology of Hagee and his ilk is exposed for how
Biblically inaccurate and destructive it really is.March 22, 2007
–--
“Restriction of free thought and free speech is the most dangerous of all subversions.” Wm O. Douglas
“Restriction of free thought and free speech is the most dangerous of all subversions.” Wm O. Douglas
